Legislature(1999 - 2000)
02/18/2000 01:12 PM House RES
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HJR 54 - EXCLUDE AK NATL FORESTS FROM ROADLESS POL Number 0170 VICE CHAIR COWDERY announced that the first order of business would be HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 54, relating to urging the exclusion of national forests in Alaska from President Clinton's proposal for withdrawal of roadless areas in the national forest system. [The sponsor, Representative Williams, had explained HJR 54 to members on February 16, 2000, but no testimony was taken on that date.] Number 0211 BOB DOTSON testified via teleconference from Ketchikan on behalf of himself, his wife and his family, who are all long-time residents of Alaska. He indicated that they are very concerned with the amount of area "locked up" already in wilderness areas. He explained that the natural resource industry in their area has one foot in the grave and the other on a slippery edge, and it is not looking like it is going to get any better. He pointed out there is a mineral deposit on Prince of Wales Island that they believe could give some high-tech industry to their area. He said that they need to pay more attention to the iron-fisted control of the federal government and that the continuing lockups need to stop. [A motion was made to adopt HJR 54, version 1-LS1391\G; however, that version, the original bill, was already before the committee.] Number 0560 JACK PHELPS, Executive Director, Alaska Forest Association (AFA), testified via teleconference from Ketchikan. He indicated that the AFA is the timber industry's trade association for Alaska, representing about 90 small businesses in the forest products sector. Mr. Phelps informed the committee that the AFA supports HJR 54 and urges the committee to move it to the floor as soon as possible. MR. PHELPS said the timber industry in Southeast Alaska has already been badly damaged by federal actions, and further withdrawal of roadless areas and prohibition on entry will have a detrimental effect on the small remaining sawmill industry. He pointed out that the effect of the roadless-area withdrawal on the Tongass National Forest would be particularly dramatic. The U.S. Forest Service and the environmental groups have been talking about 14.9 million acres that qualify for [the] roadless [designation] in Alaska, but fail to point out that most of that is already protected under some form of federal action. Mr. Phelps said the real issue is the 403,000 acres that are still in the Tongass National Forest's available commercial forest land. MR. PHELPS noted that if the roadless policy is applied to the Tongass, the land available for scheduled timber sales will likely be reduced from 576,000 acres to approximately 183,000 acres, which is a very small parcel of land and certainly not large enough to support the existing industry. He explained that the resolution has very clear statements about prohibitions that were set forward in ANILCA [Alaska National Interest Lands Conservation Act], and the state should demand that no more clauses of ANILCA be honored by the President. There seems to be widespread opposition within Alaska with regard to the roadless policy, and [AFA] urges the legislature to join that chorus with full voice. Number 0822 VICE CHAIR COWDERY wondered if the President's proposed amendment has had much public input or analysis. MR. PHELPS indicated that the actual analysis that was received during the scoping period has not yet been released. He explained that the majority of the comments were received by e- mail and seem to be related to campaigns. They are awaiting some analysis from the forest service as to the breakdown of what the comments were, but they don't have any solid information at the present time. JACK SHAY, Mayor, Ketchikan Gateway Borough, testified via teleconference from Ketchikan. He stated that the roadless policy would create tremendous local and statewide impacts. He agreed with Representative Williams' statement [at the previous hearing] that the roadless policy is an attack on the working people of Alaska. He indicated that when they met with Under Secretary Lyons last year at the Southeast Conference in Sitka, he spoke of many different measures but did not mention the roadless proposal. Soon after the conference, when they heard of the proposal, they were astonished and felt betrayed. He referred to Vice President Gore's inaugural address, in which he said that they had saved the Tongass National Forest; he wondered what Vice President Gore thinks he is saving the Tongass from. He stressed that all he is saving it from is potential jobs, prosperity and "living wages." He indicated that they are sending a letter to Vice President Gore urging him to understand their situation. He stated that he is very disappointed in the measure and believes it shows a complete lack of understanding with regard to the issues in Southeast Alaska. He added that he hopes the committee will favorably consider HJR 54. Number 1137 CALEB WARDLAW, Sitka Conservation Society, testified via teleconference from Sitka. He stated: I would just like to ask that you please do not urge the exclusion of Alaska national forests from the proposed forest service roadless policy. Various industries in Southeast Alaska will experience various economic results, depending on the inclusion or exclusion of the Tongass in this policy; however, Southeast Alaska will undoubtedly experience a net socioeconomic gain from the Tongass being included in this policy. This policy will not damage the timber industry. There is a worldwide trend toward recycling and increasing wood product substitutes. The future holds less of a demand for timber than today. Even if the timber demand were to remain steady and the Tongass were to be included in the new policy, there would still be plenty of Tongass timber available to sustain a healthy industry. According to an analysis of forest service data of tentatively suitable forest lands, there are currently 10 billion board feet of timber accessible from existing Tongass roads. This would allow for an annual harvest of 100 million board feet a year, even if the Tongass were included in the policy. Furthermore, the Tongass's inclusion in the roadless policy will ensure that the Tongass remains the crown jewel of the United States national forest system. In the Lower 48 there are no forests as vast and pristine as the Tongass. In fact, every day pristine forests become scarcer. Pristine forests offer incomparable recreational experiences and valuable fish and wildlife habitat. These qualities are coming to be recognized as golden. In other words, the Tongass, if left pristine, will become a gold mine. Every day, more people are willing to pay more dollars to experience pristine forests. The Tongass would include the largest "unroaded" expanses of forest in the United States. That means it would be a commodity unequaled anywhere in the whole United States. Furthermore, the Southeast Alaska fishing industry is close to a $300-million-a-year fishery. The fishing industry stands nothing to gain from the Tongass being excluded from this policy; however, it is guaranteed to lose from the Tongass's exclusion. Improperly maintained roads are the main threat to [the water habitat of] anadromous fish .... As of this day, the forest service is hard pressed to maintain the current 4,500 miles of Tongass road. The cost of fixing culvert problems alone within the Tongass is going to cost an estimated $20 million. With existing forest service financial constraints, roads will ... not [be] properly maintained. Furthermore, this policy is not in violation of ANILCA, because it does not propose new wilderness or conservation areas; it simply proposes a restriction on new roads. The state legislature of Alaska should not unilaterally oppose the forest service in continuing their analyses of the benefits and costs of Alaska's forest roads. The draft EIS [Environmental Impact Statement] will be structured with multiple alternatives and will give the legislature, as well as the individual citizens of Alaska, an opportunity to comment at that point in the process. Thank you for the chance to comment. Number 1370 REPRESENTATIVE BARNES asked whether the Sitka Conservation Society is apart of the Alaska Conservation Voice. MR. WARDLAW said that he was not sure. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES indicated that she believes they are. She referred to the testimony given on SB 7 opposing the transfer of land to the University of Alaska, noting that one of the issues the Alaska Conservation Voice had raised was lack of access to that land. She wondered how Mr. Wardlaw could square his testimony with the testimony given on SB 7 with regard to access. MR. WARDLAW stated that he is not familiar with the testimony and is not representing the parties that Representative Barnes had mentioned; therefore, he was unable to answer the question. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES asked Mr. Wardlaw if he is familiar with RS 2477. MR. WARDLAW requested clarification. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES explained that RS 2477 has to do with access across lands from identified trails that were in the state prior to the time of statehood, and that could be used to access holdings in the state. She again asked Mr. Wardlaw if he is familiar with RS 2477. MR. WARDLAW replied no. Number 1492 CORRIE BOSMAN testified via teleconference from Anchorage, stating: Mr. Chairman and members of the board, thank you very much for hearing my testimony. I do want to get on record in opposition to this resolution. First off, I want to answer some of the questions that have been raised, both on Wednesday and here today. In regard to public input on this process, this process is a result of about 30 years of public input. In particular, on this policy, more than half of a million comments have been submitted to the forest service about this policy. I believe that that's more than adequate to say that the public has spoken up in this case. In regard to Representative Barnes' question regarding RS 2477, in the scoping notice that the forest service provided to the public on this policy they specifically state, and I quote, "forest service regulation and policy, in short, access provided by statute, treaty or pursuant to reserved or outstanding right," and this rule would not affect any preexisting right. This rule would also not affect preexisting access rights for permit holders or for projects already under contract. So, I do hope that that addresses your concern, and that does include the RS 2477 land. In regard to why this policy is good for Alaska, I think, as one of the previous folks who testified mentioned, the Southeast Alaskan economy has been diversifying very rapidly over the last 20 years, in particular, over the last five years with the closer of the Ketchikan pulp mill and also the Sitka pulp mill. Our largest industries remaining in Southeast Alaska are the fishing industry and the fastest-growing industry in the state, which of course is tourism. Tourists do not come to Alaska to view clearcuts and to see landscape that has been scarred by road development. They come here because of the wild character our land has to offer. They come here to charter boats to go fishing. They come here to hire guides to go hunting. It is conclusively found, scientifically, that roads degrade both fish and wildlife habitat. If we would like to keep both our local hunting and fishing subsistence continual, as well as the outside tourists to come and bring money to our state, it is imperative that we protect the roadless areas of both the Tongass and Chugach National Forest. I'd also like to mention something that Representative Bill Williams, [in] his testimony on Wednesday, talked about, and that is in regard for the fact that he called this a "political science policy." I would like to point out, to both the chair and the members of this committee, that over 330 scientists - including several very prominent Nobel prize winners and over 100 Alaskan scientists, many of who worked on the Tongass Land Management Plan [TLMP] - have written President Clinton asking that this policy include Alaska's forest for sound ecological reasons. The only political science we're talking about here is this resolution. ... I would like to address the concerns that have been raised about ANILCA, in particular, to this resolution. First of all, this proposal will not lead to a RARE [roadless area review and evaluation] 3, as is proposed in the resolution on page 1, lines 12 through 15. This is not going to be a new RARE 3. If you would look in the forest service documents, they specifically state there will not be a RARE 3. This roadless policy pertains only to RARE 2 inventory to roadless areas. Secondly, no land will be withdrawn under this policy, as suggested in the resolution page 2, lines 1 through 3. Third, this renewal of conservation units as suggested in the resolution is completely unfounded. This policy is strictly a management policy to manage conservation units, in particular, the Tongass and Chugach National Forests here in Alaska, as well as all of the other forests outside - to manage those units, which were created as conservation units almost 100 years ago. This is completely a management policy. This does not fall within the ANILCA sections that you have here in this resolution, and I ask that you really seek outside legal assistance to ensure that what you're doing is following the law, because I believe that this is incorrect legally. ... There was some concern raised by Representative William regarding the Chugach National Forest and the fact that it's currently in the process of creating the new forest plan. I would like to point out to the chair and the members of the committee that there are 35 forests throughout the nation that are currently in the same situation as the Chugach National Forest. The forest service has recognized that this is obviously an ongoing problem. They are working with forest managers to ensure that the roadless policy meshes with those forest plans. They do not plan on stopping the process. They are going ahead full steam, and I would just suggest that they look at the alternative of how the roadless policy fits into these alternatives they are creating. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and members of the committee for listening, and I'm certainly willing to take some questions. Number 1843 REPRESENTATIVE BARNES asked Ms. Bosman if she supports hunting on these lands. MS. BOSMAN replied yes. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES wondered how these people are going to access these lands if they are roadless and there is no access to them. MS. BOSMAN explained that there are 4,650 miles of road in the Tongass National Forest; therefore, there are 4,650 miles of opportunity for people to access the Tongass to hunt and fish. She said she believes it is more than adequate. Number 1892 REPRESENTATIVE BARNES indicated that the roads would become overgrown, because they would not be kept up under the proposals that are being enumerated. MS. BOSMAN explained that the policy does not say that they will be decommissioning or shutting down any preexisting roads. The policy states that they will not be constructing new roads; therefore, it has nothing to do with the roads that already exist. She pointed out that the forest service has grossly inadequate resources to manage the existing road system, which totals over 380,000 miles of road throughout the national forest system. They get about 20 percent of the budget they need in order to maintain these existing roads, so the roads are not being maintained to begin with. She emphasized that the policy strictly deals with the construction of new roads only, in pristine areas. REPRESENTATIVE BARNES restated that the roads would become overgrown and it would thus become a roadless area; therefore, people would not have access. PAM LABOLLE, President, Alaska State Chamber of Commerce (ASCC), stated that they are in support of HJR 54. She explained that they believe the roadless issue for the Tongass was completed in the 13-year, $10 million TLMP, and if any part of Alaska is reviewed for the purpose of considering conservation measures, it is in violation of the "no more" clause of ANILCA. DICK COOSE, Executive Director, Concerned Alaskans for Resources and Environment (CARE) and President, Ketchikan Chamber of Commerce, testified via teleconference from Ketchikan. He said the "locking up" of Alaska's land and natural resources has to stop. He indicated that the Clinton Administration and the national and local environmental organizations that are funded nationally have basically destroyed a balanced economy in Ketchikan. He strongly urged the Governor and the state to fight the roadless policy, and he suggested that the resolution oppose the "lockup" both in Alaska and the entire United States. He referred to previous testimony and pointed out that roads do not degrade fish and wildlife habitat if they are done properly. He urged the committee to pass HJR 54. VICE CHAIR COWDERY closed public testimony on HJR 54. [HJR 54 was held over.]
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